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0:00 - Are there any particular stories of a victim that maybe sticks out to you that kind of just continues 0:05 to push you and to drive you during difficult times? - When they finally did in quotations find her, 0:11 it was her dead body in the foothills of Las Vegas and they only identified her 'cause of her dental records. 0:16 I think they said that she was 13 years old and three months pregnant. And that's the reality of the situation that's happening today to children all across America. 0:24 And some of those parents will never, ever receive a phone call, they'll never find their child. - So you went to University 0:30 of Phoenix at such a young age you could have gone to a traditional university. - So many things that kind of just fell into 0:36 place with that. And even for like my future plans. And so yeah, I just, I just trusted that feeling 0:43 that I was supposed to go to ��������. And long story short, I went from I, 'cause I think it was a full close 0:50 to like a $50,000 degree just through like miraculous circumstance. After miraculous circumstance, 0:56 I walked out set free like it was crazy. 1:10 - Welcome to the Degrees of Success podcast. My name is Frida Richards and I'm your host. 1:16 And today we have an awesome guest. Today we have Kylie Glendenning at just 19 years old, 1:24 is an already accomplished advocate, a pageant winner, a podcaster, and she's just graduated 1:30 with her bachelor's degree from ��������. She's deeply committed to combating the devastating issues 1:37 of sexual exploitation and empowering survivors. Kylie is also the founder 1:43 and host of the Freedom Project podcast where she engages in critical conversations with experts 1:49 and advocates in the field. Kylie, thank you so much for joining us. - Yeah, thank you for having me. 1:55 - Of course, of course. You know your story's incredible and your drive is as well. 2:01 So we wanna jump right in and start talking about where it came from. Let's talk about your childhood. 2:06 What was that like growing up? - So growing up I really had no experience 2:12 with any kind of trafficking. My family had immigrated on my mom's side from Mexico 2:19 and unfortunately out of I think five or five of all of my aunts had experienced sexual 2:25 exploitation both in Mexico and in the United States. And so growing up that was something that I was in the midst A Victim’s Story That Changed Everything 2:31 of that environment, but I didn't even fully understand what that was or how it related to trafficking. 2:37 And it wasn't until I went into CBC, which is where I started my associate's degree, 2:43 that my international relations teacher had us do this project where we would write to Congress, 2:49 but we had to pick a topics like issues that we found that were the most important. So I was looking on this list 2:54 and I had saw one that said child sex trafficking. And I didn't know quite what that was like at that point. 3:00 All I thought of of trafficking was like white vans and the movie taken. And so I was like, well let's research this. 3:06 Let's see what there is to see about this. So that was like the iceberg, like the very tip of the iceberg. 3:12 And when I learned about this, I had learned about how unfortunately it was a poverty issue in Cambodia 3:19 where there were families living on less than like $2 a day. And what would happen is you had, 3:25 let's say like a household provider, like a father got sick with any kind of disease. If they couldn't afford to pay like a hospital bill, 3:32 they would take out a loan that they could not afford that had really high interest rates. And so obviously they're living on less than $2 a day, 3:39 they're never ever gonna pay that back. And so the interest would just keep spiking and spiking and spiking until loan sharks would come 3:45 and they would start hassling these families and they already have basically nothing. They're living in poverty. 3:51 And what would happen a lot is they would say, well what we can do instead is we'll take your little girl 3:56 for six months for a year. And they would, they would traffic these young girls, 4:01 they could be as young, well really they could be as young as as very, very, very small children we're talking infants, toddlers. 4:07 You'd see some in six, six years old, eight years old. There was a high prevalence of like suicide rates 4:13 for these children because they just could not take the abuse that they were enduring. And so you are hearing about this 4:21 and I've never seen anything like this. I've never heard of anything like this. And it just really pierced my soul. I was like, what in the world? Like what is this? 4:28 And so I remember passionately writing, I think it was to Dan Newhouse, he was one of my representatives. 4:34 And telling him, I was like, we need to put sanctions, we need to, we need to be advocating and helping these people. 4:40 And that is very important. We definitely should have a focus on international trafficking and and combating that. 4:45 And at the time Cambodia was like the largest hot hotspot for child sex trafficking in the world. 4:51 People would travel to Cambodia to traffic children and, and they call it sex tourism. 4:57 They would go to different places to buy sex. So hearing about that, I still did not click. 5:04 It didn't, it didn't click in my brain that it doesn't just happen in Cambodia. 'cause it at that point my mindset was well this is a third 5:11 world country issue and this is what we need to combat. And it wasn't until I started working at a crisis pregnancy 5:17 center, I grabbed a book off the shelf and I started reading that book was called Renting Lacey. 5:22 And when I started reading this book, it was talking about how the author was combating sex trafficking in America. 5:30 And here's the crazy part, she was eating dinner at this restaurant and it said it overlooked the Columbia River. 5:35 And I almost dropped the book 'cause I live on the Columbia River. And I was like, there's no way she's talking about like this 5:41 is my backyard, she's talking about the restaurants in the city that I grew up in. And I was thinking, there's no way How Human Traffickers Operate & Their Tactics 5:47 that this is happening here. And the more I started researching, well then I started looking up, 5:52 well sex trafficking in the Tri-Cities and article after article after article kept popping up like pastors, 5:59 the fire chief, a superintendent, like there were lots of very high ranking officials 6:04 who were getting caught in sextings or in watching child pornography or distributing it, you know, soliciting sex. 6:11 And so it was like the more I dove into this, I was like, oh my gosh, it really does happen here as well. 6:16 So at that point I got plugged in with a ministry called Mere Ministries and they did trafficking prevention and training. 6:23 And this is where I started to recognize and respond to trafficking itself. 6:28 So if I saw some red flags, like if I was going to hotel and I saw multiple people without luggage wearing very 6:35 little clothing or maybe they had lots of hotel keys, but there's only one person like why are you staying in 6:41 that many, you know, hotel rooms and just different things like that, like how to identify these signs and not only that 6:48 but how to actually, we call it couch, couch talk couch questions. 6:53 And so it's how do you actually engage with somebody who you think may be trafficked in such a way where it doesn't feel like an 6:59 interrogation and they shut down. So how do we actually reach and respond to these victims in such a way where they feel comfortable 7:06 to disclose things to you and then you can get them the help that they need. And so - I've actually seen that there's a hand sign 7:14 or something that that typically that we should be looking out for that people could be signaling so 7:20 that we can alert authorities or do our best to try to help them. Is is that true? 7:25 - So here's a really interesting thing to talk about that has to do with domestic violence. So I've actually gotten that question before, yes 7:34 and no, that's domestic violence, which is kind of different than trafficking itself. So it, an easy way to think about it is 7:43 exploitation plus money is trafficking. There has to be commercial value aspect in that most women 7:49 who, and men, this is an issue that pertains to all genders and all, all races, social economic backgrounds. 7:55 But most people who are being trafficked don't actually know that they're being trafficked. 8:00 And most people don't understand that. And so here's a really crazy thing. Traffickers, they're groomers, they are very manipulative. 8:08 And if I can convince you that you, it's your choice to stay here while I'm using forced fraud coercion 8:14 to actually make you stay there. So it's not really your choice, but I'm brainwashing you, I'm manipulating you into thinking The Reality of Human Trafficking in the U.S. 8:19 that it is your choice. You're never gonna find any way to leave, you're never gonna want any reason to leave 8:25 because I'm looking for your vulnerabilities. I'm meeting those and then I'm withdrawing them when 8:30 you don't do what I want. Which is basically they want them to have sex with strangers for money. 8:35 So they'll withdraw that, whether it's love or a place to stay or food or drugs. 8:40 And then when you do do what they want, then they, they give that back. So it's just like this cycle that goes on and on. 8:46 So most people don't actually know that they're being trafficked so they wouldn't give you a signal. And then they're also brainwashed to think 8:52 that the police are bad, that they're gonna get you arrested as a prostitute rather than helped and provided survivor services. 8:59 - I'm so glad you just said that because that was my next question. What's the difference between, I mean I clearly being a prostitute is when you voluntarily 9:07 decide to do that and then there's sex trafficking. But if you're saying that they are brainwashed intuit it 9:14 then how do you, how do you decipher? And to your earlier point, that has to be a challenge. 9:19 - Yeah, so here's where there's a lot of different opinions and ideas within the anti-trafficking industry. 9:26 It's my personal opinion. I personally don't believe that it is anyone's choice to prostitute themselves. 9:32 So this is where we, we get into their childhood, the majority of people 9:38 who are in trafficking have been sexually exploited as a child. And so you grow up in an environment 9:43 where maybe mom is a druggie and she's trying to supply her drug addiction. 9:49 And we've had people at five years old where they're being sent grown men to their room in exchange 9:55 for drugs to, for the mom to supply her drug addiction. So you grow up being sexually exploitated 10:01 and some people don't even understand that their first trafficker was their mom. So then when they grow up 10:07 and they basically move from one trafficker to another because somebody spots them, they go through the grooming process and 10:14 because that's, it's horrible, but that's their version of normal. They don't even understand the difference. The Rise of Missing Children in the U.S. 10:19 And so they think again that it's their choice, but there has been that element of they've been groomed since they were a child. 10:26 - My goodness. So I wanna take us back to you growing up 10:32 and your family, because I heard you say that your, your aunts actually experienced something similar. 10:39 Tell me more about that. - So a lot of my aunts experienced just sexual exploitation. 10:46 I wouldn't necessarily consider that trafficking 'cause again, there has to be that commercial aspect that would be more under the category of domestic violence. 10:52 But unfortunately in different cultures there are different standards, not for every single family, 11:00 but it just depends on where you live and what the expectations are. So a lot of them were getting quotations like married at 11:07 like 12 years old to people that were like 26 that were not the greatest, you know, people. 11:12 And so multiple of my aunts were having children by like 13 or 14. 11:20 And essentially, basically they, I think that they were sold, you know, and there have been conversations, 11:28 well this person can provide for you but at the end of the day, like I live in America 11:34 and that you're a child, you can't make those kinds of decisions. I think - No, absolutely not. 11:39 I completely agree with you. Let me ask you this being that that happened to your aunts at such a young age 11:44 and you, you experienced it firsthand, is that where the passion and the drive comes from? 11:50 Because even your job that you mentioned, you were reading the book you were serving, is that where your heart comes for serving? 11:58 - I think that, I remember when I heard about it because when I was 12:05 growing up it was a lot. It was very like hush hush. It was swept under the rug and there was very much this mentality 12:11 of whatever's happened to you in the past, like that's in the past. Like you just need to get over it, you just need to move on. Like why are you bringing up things from the past? 12:18 Why are you just trying to create drama? And so I actually didn't know a lot about a lot of these things until I was older. 12:24 But when I did find out, I just remember I was just so angry and I was hurt and disappointed. 12:30 And I would go to bed like night after night and I would just kind of sit there and think 12:35 and I was like, well why did nobody do anything about this? Like why did nobody say anything about this? But I think the most like prevalent thought 12:41 that I had was who's going to do something about this? Because I know that my family couldn't have been just the 12:47 only ones who had experienced something like this. And then I found out like what trafficking was and that was the same thought that I had of like, 12:54 why is no one talking about this? You know? And when I was reading that book Renting Lacey, 13:01 it's just, it's just childish like naiveness, you know, I kept waiting 'cause it's following like this character 13:09 and it's not a real character but it's showing you what happens in trafficking situations. And I kept waiting for someone to come rescue her like, 13:15 and I'm getting concerned because I'm getting to the end of the book and I'm like, when are the police gonna come? Like when you know, 13:21 when is somebody gonna come rescue this girl? And I get to the end of the book, you know, I'm getting concerned. I mean it's like three pages 13:27 and then it's two pages and then it's one paragraph. And they never did. Nobody ever did find her. And when they finally did in quotations find her, 13:35 it was her dead body in the foothills of Las Vegas. And they only identified her 'cause of her dental records. 13:40 I think they said that she was 13 years old and three months pregnant. And that's the reality of the situation 13:46 that's happening today to children all across America. And some of those parents will never ever receive a phone call. 13:51 They'll never find their child. Some of these people, I think the average lifespan once you 13:56 enter into trafficking is seven years. Like they're quite literally stealing the, the bodies 14:02 and souls and future of children all across America. And you have that thought of who's gonna do something about this? 14:08 'cause this is actually horrific. This is, you know, it is just horrible. 14:15 - I can completely understand why you're so passionate about this. And now I have a new book to read because I could see where your drive would come from. 14:23 And then I would also want, okay, let's save Lacey, what, what's next? Or is she now gonna become, you know, an advocate for 14:30 for sex trafficking and and help change the world? But it seems that the author was going for more of a realistic stereotypical path 14:38 of a sex trafficked person. Wow. Well thank you for the new read 14:45 'cause I'm definitely gonna have to look into that. You clearly meet a lot of and speak to a lot of people. 14:53 Are there any particular stories of a victim that maybe sticks out to you that kind of just continues 14:59 to push you and to drive you during difficult times? - Yeah, so the reason why I actually picked anti-trafficking 15:07 as my platform is because of one story of how it personally impacted my life. So this was after I went through all of that training 15:13 and I was probably 18 years old at the time and I was thinking that, yeah, I mean 18 year olds, yeah we can make a difference in the world. 15:20 Like for sure we're the future. But I didn't actually understand like what kind of power people have simply by opening their mouth. 15:27 And if you are willing to just speak, if you're willing to speak truth, then you can impact so many lives. 15:33 You can set so many people free just if you are willing to stick your head up and move forward. And I, at that time I was training for a half marathon What Can Be Done to Stop Trafficking? 15:41 and I was in my park and I was running and I actually ran past this homeless woman 15:47 and she just kind of was walking aimlessly. Like you could tell that she didn't like, 15:52 there wasn't a purpose to where she was going and you could tell kind of by her walking pattern, she's just kind of walking around doing something. 15:57 And I remember when I ran past her I just like kind of stopped and like looked at her 16:03 and I ran past thinking like maybe I should go talk to her. And I felt like my mom's words in the back of my head, like, Kylie, don't you dare talk to strangers, 16:11 but if you ever have like a gut feeling like you need to do something, like I had one of those moments where I felt like I need to go talk to this woman. 16:17 And so when I ran back I saw that she had wandered and she sat on this park bench. And the crazy thing is it was 16:23 that same river she's overlooking the Columbia River and she's just sitting, just staring out. I don't know what she was looking at, but I came up like 16:32 beside her and I didn't know how I was gonna start a conversation, but we just kind of entered into one. 16:38 And at first I thought well maybe I'm gonna help her with like housing because she, 16:44 I mean she clearly was homeless, you know. And so I entered this conversation with her and you can definitely tell like she has a, a prior use 16:51 of substance and so that she had done drugs before and the more I talked with her, I was saying flipping 16:57 through resources in my head. 'cause at the time I worked at a pregnancy center. So there's all these different resources that we would help, 17:02 you know, pregnant clients with and like outsource them to. So I'm flipping through like different substance abuse 17:07 places, different, you know, homeless shelters that we have and homeless programs until she made reference 17:13 to in the Life. And that's a trafficking terminology. And I would never have known that 17:18 unless I had taken that trafficking training course through Mere Ministries. 17:23 And so at that point everything in my brain just started to redirect and you know, and I started going into that, that couch talk of 17:31 how do I actually engage in a conversation with her to learn more about what's going on without her feeling like 17:36 she's being interrogated. And so I started engaged in Couch Talk and weaning through and it definitely sounds like she had been doing 17:44 survival sex trafficking or that there was also a presence of a boyfriend who was trafficking her. 17:50 And so into this conversation, I, I give her an example of a very, very common trafficking situation. 17:57 I asked her, does this sound like something similar has happened to you? She's like, oh yeah, this is this, this is what happened. 18:02 And so at that point I had asked her, and here's a very important thing is if somebody is over 18, 18:10 you cannot, you cannot force them, I mean really with the child either, but you can't force them to go anywhere. They don't want to. You have to ask them like, 18:16 would you like me to do this? Would you like me to do that? Or call this place whether, whereas if it's a child like you, 18:22 you're a mandated report, you have to call CPS. So I had asked her, you know, I have some friends and they help girls who are in the life 18:29 and it was my ministries. And I said, would you be okay? Would you be okay if I called them and if they came? 18:36 So I called her and I had an advocate come meet this gal and go through their process. 18:41 'cause at that point I wasn't fully like trauma informed, trauma trained on this kind of thing. And I like there, there needs 18:46 to be professionals who like step into this. And so they came and they helped this woman out. And it wasn't until later, probably like maybe a year 18:54 and a half later that when I started working for me ministries, I actually found out what ended up happening to her. 19:00 It was she was able to receive the support that she needed and she is doing a lot better today. 19:05 - Excellent. And that was all because you were brave enough to listen to that voice in your head and stop and speak to her 19:12 and to call the resources that you knew that were available? - Yeah, and I think it was at that moment I realized 19:18 that anybody can help somebody who's being trafficked. And I didn't really know a whole lot. 19:24 I was just 18 years old. And so I was thinking why aren't schools equipped with this? Why are, you know, are all these places like equipped 19:31 with this knowledge of how to identify these things and the the tools and resources that they need to respond to this? 19:37 - That's an excellent question. And I, I say that because I was grabbing french fries for my son, 19:43 this is about two months ago. I was grabbing french fries for him and there was a young lady 19:48 that was just sitting on the curb at the parking lot. So she was kind of in front of a parking space 19:54 and I was driving away and that same voice you were talking about, Kylie hit me in the back of the head and I was like, Kylie’s Advocacy & Mission to Fight Exploitation 20:00 but I'm on my way home and I, I gotta, I've gotta do this and that. And then it just, it was a strong encouragement, 20:06 go back and check on her. And I, I went there and I, I asked her from the window like, are you okay? 20:13 And then, you know, she kind of just was like kindly waving me off. She was wearing a mask and I could and, and a hoodie 20:19 and you could tell that she was just very, very small and, and there was a car behind her that had their lights on, 20:26 which I thought was odd because I wouldn't do that. Like if there was a human being in front of me, I wouldn't like have my, my lights on. Kylie’s Education at �������� 20:33 And so I thought that that was odd. But as I, then I came to sit next to her because I felt like she 20:39 probably just felt distanced from me. So I came to sit next to her and I saw that she was wearing like the thinnest shoes, like they were so thin 20:46 and you could tell that she had been walking so much, her feet had been, they were flip flops and her feet look worn. 20:51 And I, and I said, do you, do you have tennis shoes? And she was like, oh, these, these are fine. They're, they're Michael course. 20:57 I'll never forget that she said that. She said, these are fine, they're, they're Michael course. And I, I took my shoes off and I gave them to her 21:04 and I said, you know, there's a lot of things on the street like you should keep your feet warm and safe. 21:09 We're here in Arizona, it is very hot. So she was probably thinking, I don't need to be warm at all, but she's wearing this hoodie. 21:16 And so I sat next to her and I said, so do you need any help or is there anyone that I can call for you? 21:22 I've gotten my cell phone, like, is there anything that I could do for you or with you? I have an Airbnb like, would you like to stay? 21:28 And she can, she kept looking over her shoulder and she was like, no, because they're, you know, they're watching. 21:33 And she was like, so you can go. And I was like, I don't, I'm, I'm safe. I am not scared. 21:39 Like do you, how can I help you? Like I will show up for you. And I stayed with her for a bit 21:44 and she just, you know, she wouldn't leave. And I, I didn't know what else to do and so I told her like, you know, it's gonna be okay. 21:52 You can do anything you wanna do and try to give her as many positive words as I could. As I drove off and as I was driving, I, I didn't have the resources, 22:02 I didn't have that knowledge and I just called the police and I said, listen, this young lady did nothing wrong. 22:10 I'm just concerned. So can you please go and just check on her. She literally did nothing. 22:16 She's sitting there, I just want someone to do a wellness check on this young lady. And I, I don't know what happened 22:22 but then I felt, I felt horrible calling the police. So is there, what, in that situation, 22:28 if someone is like me and hears that same voice that you were speaking about before, what, what, what are we to do? 22:34 What's, what's the best course of action? - Yeah, so I would definitely recommend that you would call 22:42 a local anti-trafficking organization. People that are trauma-informed, especially within the realm 22:47 of trafficking, like advocates to walk alongside survivors of sex trafficking are gonna be your best bet. 22:52 So like if you were to have called a local place like that, that probably would've been the best answer. 22:58 Some things to keep in mind, especially pertaining to what you described is if she has been beaten before 23:05 and she's saying, Hey, they're watching anything you say to her, you have to shed like from a, 23:11 from a brain standpoint is probably like in one ear and out the other because she's in a state of panic. 23:17 She's like, Hey, they're watching me, you don't understand, like when I get home they're gonna be like, who are you talking to? 23:23 Why were you talking to them? You trying to leave? And then they get beat. Oh my goodness. 23:28 And so you have to understand like they come from a place of extreme abuse, extreme trauma. 23:35 And many times people ask, well why don't they just leave? Like, why don't you just leave? Why don't you just go? 23:42 And so sometimes it's at a place where you, you financially can't, it's it's sometimes it is, 23:49 but it's rarely ever where you're chained to the floor and it's like you physically cannot leave. But there are so many barriers 23:56 to actually entering back into society. And so here's a great example. Let's say that same woman met, met a guy 24:04 who ended up being her trafficker. Well so many times they can manipulate the victims into 24:10 giving them their credit card or signing onto an apartment. Well guess what? Because they're not the ones who are really gonna pay for it. 24:15 I'm gonna trash the apartment, I'm not gonna pay for rent, I'm gonna ruin your lease. You know I'm gonna charge out max out your credit card. 24:23 So your credit score goes down and I'm gonna purposely try to get you arrested. So now you have a record. So then I'm gonna come back 24:28 and tell you, you are never gonna get a place to live. No one will ever rent to you. You can't get anything with your card 24:34 'cause your credit score sucks and where are you gonna work because you have a record, no one's gonna hire you. 24:40 So they quite literally find ways to trap people there. And so in a sense, yes, you physically can leave, 24:46 but there's nowhere to go. And the people that they are specifically choosing, like again, anyone can be trafficked, 24:52 but they're targeting people on purpose. They're targeting like foster youth, that is a big one because they slip through the cracks. 24:58 There's so many people that are actually within the care of, 25:03 of DCYF and what is - DCYF, - The Department of Children and Youth Services. 25:09 But that can look different for different states, but basically in the custody of the state and they go missing, like how does that happen? 25:15 You know? And so they're the foster youth are being targeted, minorities are being targeted, low income people are being targeted 25:21 because it can be so easy to manipulate them in their circumstances. And that's exactly what traffickers they want. 25:26 They want people that that they can sell. Because unfortunately it, it's horrible. How to Spot Signs of Trafficking & Protect Others 25:32 But it is an economic model where they are, they're selling a product which is a person, person 25:38 with human value. But nevertheless they view the mass products. 25:44 - What do Kylie in that if, if this were to happen again and I were, I wanna be prepared 25:51 and I don't want her to get hurt or him, if that's a possibility as well. I don't know what those statistics are like as far 25:56 as the ratio to men or women. I imagine that women would be higher. What, what would that look like? 26:02 Tell me, tell me what would the, what's the proper process? I don't know know what couch talk is, are there some bullets that you can give myself and the other listeners? 26:11 - Yeah, so I would tell them starting off it, there's some deescalation techniques that you can use. 26:18 So one of them is simply saying, I hear you, I hear you, I hear what you're going through. 26:24 I wouldn't say I understand because at the end of the day we don't, we really don't understand. We actually have no idea. 26:29 That's not the phrase to use because I don't know what it's like to be sold for sex. I don't know what it's like to be 26:35 starved and locked in a room. I dunno what it's like to have my foot cut open when I say I wanna leave. 26:40 I don't know what that's like. And so I'm not gonna pretend like I know what that's like, but what I can say is, I hear you and I'm here for you. 26:47 And another thing to understand is there is, we call it this, the cycle of change. 26:53 The cycle of like of leaving or leaving the life or in the game, I would be up to term on 27:01 terminology within trafficking. 'cause it is its own subculture. So if you hear terms like in the game, in the life 27:09 on the track or on the blade, these are all signs that indicate they have had some kind 27:14 of exposure to trafficking. 'cause how are you gonna know about something that you're not a part of? 27:20 So those are all things to keep in mind. But also understanding that there's different stages. Like there's pre-contemplation 27:26 where they're thinking about leaving, but then there's all these reasons why they should stay. And then there's like that first stage of contemplation 27:32 where, well what would happen if I did leave? You know? And then there's where they're actively trying to leave and sometimes there's relapse, right? 27:38 Because manipulators like traffickers are just such good manipulators. They know exactly what strings they need to pull. 27:45 Somebody I would read up on who gives just gives great examples is Rebecca Bender, she actually founded the Rebecca Bender initiative 27:52 where she helps women go get out of the life. And so she talks about 27:58 how she actually escaped from her trafficker. She got away and she hit a low point and she was talking about things where, 28:05 'cause you have to understand sometimes life can seem really good compared to what they used to have. 28:11 So she was living in this luxury apartment, she was living, you know, in this house where, you know, she did get beat. 28:17 But you know what she did get? She got Louis Vuitton, she got Michael Kors, she got the purses and the things, she just had to sleep 28:23 with all these people, right? And she hated it. But also like this luxury lifestyle some 28:28 was something that she never had before. And so then to leave that and then have to get this like dingy apartment 28:34 and live on food stamps with her child trying to overcome her drug addiction, you know, and people in the line, she talked about how 28:40 how judgmental they looked at her as she handed in her food stamps. Well when the trafficker comes calling saying, 28:46 well why don't you just come back here? It can be really easy to look back and say, well at least I had a roof over my head. 28:52 At least I got fed. At least I got this. And it's easy to kind of trauma block. Well didn't he beat you? 28:58 Didn't he bash your head into the wall? - In some of our trainings we have explained to people 29:03 that it can get really twisted and just the manipulation process of where people are are just being completely brainwashed. 29:09 And there was this woman and she was saying that my boyfriend loves me and he loaded seven bullets into a revol, like a revolver. 29:18 And he spun it and he clicked every single one against her head. Oh, but he didn't stop like, you know, the one 29:25 where there was a bullet, he, he didn't pull that one. So he loves me, that's how I know he loves me 'cause he could have killed me and he didn't. 29:30 And so like that's how twisted it gets. Like it is just crazy what these women have gone through 29:36 and it is just, yeah, it's insane what these women have gone through, but that's really how bad things can get. 29:43 And I think when you go through so many of these traumatic experiences, it's, there's this like, 29:50 there's trauma bonding that happens and it's, it can become so hard to leave because there's also that fear of the unknown of, 29:57 I know it's horrible here and I hate it here, but what happens if I leave? Like it's almost scarier. At least I know what 30:02 to expect here. I know what, what the rules are here but to go out. What if I can't, you know, what if I don't make it? 30:08 What if all these different things, - Fear is keeping them still. 30:14 I have to ask you Kylie one, one of the things that you and I have in common or that we're, we're both �������� students. 30:21 I'm, I'm currently getting my doctorate and you just graduated and with your, with your bachelor's 30:26 and are heading back with your master's. But what we don't have in common is as I'm hearing these stories, I 30:34 I'm emotionally taken back. Like I am immediately affected by the stories that you're telling me. 30:40 And I know that in your training you must have learned to be able to cope or to be able to, to listen Final Thoughts & How You Can Take Action 30:49 and to to hear them, to be able to not react emotionally but to be more helpful. 30:56 Tell me about like your, your training, what that looks like as you continue to pursue your degrees. 31:02 Like what, what, what does that look like on your path? And tell me about some of that training that actually gets you to not be as emotional as I am 31:11 in hearing these stories. - So I, I would say to that everybody has different giftings. 31:17 There's things that some people like excel in that others, others excel in like other areas. 31:23 And so there are people within our ministry who are very passionate about anti-trafficking work, 31:30 but they do that from the side of like a data analyst. And they're super passionate about that. They're great with numbers, that's how they 31:35 help, that's how they contribute. But if you were to stick them in a room with somebody with a survivor and have 'em start telling their 31:40 story, they could not handle that. And so there's so many ways to impact the lives of those being trafficked. 31:47 But if you are an emotional person, like that's okay, that's how you're created. Like that is a strength in itself in so many different ways. 31:53 And there's no need or there's no reason to be ashamed of that because that's helpful in itself, right? 31:59 Because you have that empathetic nature, you're able to connect to people, you're able to make them see, feel seen and loved. 32:05 But I wouldn't try suppressing your own gift to, to try to do something else. 32:11 But I would find ways of how does that fit in? How does that plug in? Because everybody brings something different to the table. We just have to see how we're gonna make this all fit. 32:18 Because it does some things to think about is there is vicarious trauma, there is 32:23 that secondhand exposure where you can be traumatized just by hearing people and their experiences and what they've gone through. 32:30 And it is heavy. It's a very emotional heavy load. So figuring out how do we cope with this? 32:35 How do we manage all the stress and all the things that come along with that. For me, I like running. I really like to run 32:41 and I'll just think I'll process. One of the things that my boss says is that, 32:48 so we are at fishing organization, so she says, pray for them as you go home. And it's like you mentally drop them off in your head. 32:54 So let's say that you have a client and you're driving down the highway and you see a house, it's obviously not their house, 33:00 but like mentally you're like, okay, I'm gonna pray for, let's say Brian, I'm gonna pray 33:05 for Brian, I'm praying for him. And then mentally I've dropped him off and when I get home there's, it's just me left in the car 33:12 because I dropped off everybody. And when I come home to work and when I go to work tomorrow, I'll pick them back up. 33:17 But when I come home they're all dropped off. And I think it's also understanding like personally what I can take rest in is that 33:25 like God actually loves them more than I do and that when I'm going to sleep, he's working behind the scenes and he's doing things 33:30 that I don't even know about to help them. And that I am not their savior. 33:36 I'm not the one who is the end all be all. I'm not the one who can fix everything. I can do my part to help, 33:43 but I, I believe that their powers higher than I am that are going to reach and respond to 'em that are gonna do, you know, 33:49 move those mountains and stuff. And so I just give my best, but I don't let people's like face rest on me. 33:56 Like, oh my gosh, I have to be the one to say them 'cause like I don't, you know, and they, there's so much empowerment within themselves of 34:04 that's their story, that's their fight. And when they walk through, like we look back, we say, oh that was Kylie's success we, so no, that was your success. 34:11 Like you walked through that, you did that you, you know, you found freedom, you stepped into that. 34:16 So there's that aspect as well. But I would say like finding things that help you de-stress, 34:21 like however that's gonna look like and that selfcare is super, super important And I would actually consciously be looking 34:28 up how to handle vicarious trauma. So for some people, they actually who work in our ministry, 34:34 they have therapists and they go to therapy and talk to their therapist about what's going on. And that helps them. Some people, it's actually mandatory 34:42 that everybody has some kind of like small group, some kind of community because this is not a job you do in isolation. 34:48 This is not a load that you carry by yourself. Like you need a community to walk this out and to be able to carry a load like this. 34:54 But having all those things in place, you are able to help people and not burn out. 35:01 'cause there can be compassion fatigue. - Absolutely. What I know is that you clearly have great guidance 35:07 because one, you are definitely in your gift for you to be able to acknowledge 35:15 and see so easily the compassion in one. 35:20 And then to say that doesn't mean that you don't have a place here. It just means that you need to find your place. 35:26 You don't need to change who you are, you have your own gift. That in itself is a very powerful message 35:32 and I'm glad that you shared it and I could see how if you are one-on-one with one 35:37 of these victims, how they can feel heard by speaking with you. And just because you have a very clear understanding and an, 35:46 and an open mind in regards to how one experience could be different from another. 35:52 But yet we're, we're all the same. We're all here having the same human experience and doing our very best. 35:57 So I, I admire you for that excellent job. Stepping into your gift, knowing your gift 36:05 and your, your power behind that and encouraging others to accept theirs. I think that that is fabulous. 36:12 I I do know that within accepting your gift, you said that you're currently at this ministry 36:20 and your boss has given you some really great feedback as far as praying for people, letting it drop off self-care and you're running. 36:29 And I heard you earlier say that you run a, you ran a 5K, is that right? - Marathon for my birthday. - That's how how did you do? 36:39 - I I finished - And that's the goal, right? Finishing. 36:45 That's awesome. Well, so I'm glad that you're, you have a hobby as well. So tell me how you're balancing all of this. 36:52 You're, you've just finished your, your bachelor's and I, I'd love to hear more about that journey, but you've, you're also moving on to your master's degree. 37:00 How are you balancing all of these things, processing what you're dealing with, your, your, your current job, 37:06 your schooling? I imagine you have a life outside of all of this 37:11 friends family. And so tell me how, how you're balancing all of that and what you plan to do moving forward 37:18 with this master's degree. - Yeah, that's a question I wanna know the answer 37:24 to as well. I think we could ask that together. I think that, you know, I have a big planner 37:33 and it is filled to the brim. I really have to learn to manage my time very effectively, 37:38 especially doing pageantry because there's so many events and appearances that happen. So I constantly have to like, I, I don't say yes 37:46 to anything without checking my planner because I do not wanna double book myself, have done it before, do not recommend. 37:52 And so I have to be really, really on top of it when it comes to, oh hey, can you stay late for this? Oh, can you come to this event? You know, can you do this? 37:59 And then also this can look different for different people, you know, of how they choose to say yes or no to things. 38:07 But again, I actually pray about different things before I say yes to it. And I'm actually asking like, God, is this a good idea? 38:13 Like, you know me better than I know myself. Like, am I gonna get brought out if I just say yes to this because I can be a yes person, 38:20 but it's actually understanding that it's okay to say no to people. It's okay to say actually, hey, I can't make it this time. 38:26 Let's do something else instead. Or hey, I'm not gonna be able to come to this event. And just having those boundaries for yourself 38:32 because what I don't wanna do is light the candle both ends and just get burnt out and then I'm not gonna be able to help anybody. 38:38 So I think it's also like knowing yourself of like what you can and can't put on your plate. And again, I think it, it comes down to that like, 38:45 like savior mentality of like, I'm not responsible for everybody and to be everything for everybody at the, 38:51 you know, all the time. You know, like people are gonna be okay and all you can do is your best 38:57 and like give people your best and honest effort and to be reliable. If you say you're gonna do something, 39:02 you follow through with it. But I think something that I, I had 39:08 to overcome like a lot of anxiety in my life because I kept getting these comments from people 39:13 and they would say like, oh my gosh, like you're like perfect. You're like perfect. And I didn't realize it at the time, 39:18 but that actually put so much anxiety on me of these people's expectations of I had to be perfect. So then whenever I made a mistake 39:25 or you know, I, I did something that was like inconvenient. I would get super stressed out and I would have like panic attacks about it 39:31 and I had to come to terms with, and it's okay to look myself in the mirror and say, guess what? I'm not perfect. 39:37 I'm not perfect and there's some grace in that and that's okay, that's a good thing that I'm not perfect. 39:42 I'm not it for everybody all the time, but I am worthy and I am important but I'm not perfect. 39:49 That's okay. And so that actually dissipated a lot of that anxiety and I was able to give myself 39:54 so much more grace walking through things and you know, sometimes I did drop the ball and that's okay and I make things right and then I move forward 40:01 because I'm not a perfect person. That's okay. But I would say to handle it, things 40:06 just like knowing yourself and what can you take on what's actually feasible, what's realistic, you know, what can be accomplished. 40:14 And I think that includes big goals. Like for me, I wanna write a book one day that's feasible but maybe, you know, I'm not saying yes to this and that 40:21 and the next thing and the next thing all at the same time. - You know what, you are absolutely remarkable. 40:27 And, and I mean that, I know that as a �������� alum, we are so proud to have you 40:34 and to share your incredible story as a �������� student and employee, I just want you to know 40:41 that I am blown away by you and you are, you were not perfect, 40:47 but what you are is honest and vulnerable. You are wise and clearly you know you are worthy and more than enough. 40:56 And that within itself is a path that I know grown women today that have not 41:03 understood as much as you have in this moment. And if I'm being completely transparent, 41:09 I still struggle in saying no. And I still have random panic, panic attacks when I'm like, 41:16 oh yes, of course I'm gonna do all the things. And then wanting to be a woman of integrity, as you had mentioned prior, I'm gonna try to do all 41:23 of the things only to then possibly beat myself up if I pack my calendar. 41:29 So such wise words, you are 19, how proud is your mother? 41:38 - She's pretty proud. Yeah, I'm really excited. I'm pretty proud of her. She, she really inspired me. 41:43 I would not have gone to Phoenix if she, 'cause she actually went first and I was so proud of her because she had repeated a grade twice when she was in 41:52 school because she only spoke Spanish. She didn't speak any English at all. And she would say that she would just sit in a classroom 41:59 because that was like before like, you know, years and years and years ago before they really had a lot of like ELA programs 42:05 and she said that they just talked in English but she didn't know any English and they were like migrant workers so they would move around a lot. 42:11 So she said they would just talk in English in a classroom full of people and like she said, I didn't understand either. It was like blah blah blah blah blah blah, blah Tina. 42:18 And she's like, huh. And she would just stare because she didn't understand what they were saying. 42:23 So she had to repeat the grade twice until she learned the language. So she graduated high school when she was 20 42:28 and by that time she was like, she just believed the lie that she was not smart enough to go to college, 42:34 that she wasn't smart at all. Like she did not, could not do education. And so I remember when she started her bachelor's program at 42:41 through ��������, I remember her telling me like, don't tell anyone Kylie, don't tell anyone because if I failed, like I don't want anyone to know 42:47 that I tried and I failed, failed. And she didn't fail. She, she went on and she got her bachelor's degree through University 42:54 of Phoenix at like 40 years old. And I was like so proud of her because I was like, you don't even understand like you, 43:00 she's just awesome. - What was that feeling when she walked across that stage? Did she actually come and graduate? 43:07 - No she didn't. She didn't. But it, we, we had a pretty big party for her. 43:12 We were just so proud of her and I was so proud just 'cause like my, my dad kept saying like, I knew you could do it. 43:17 Like I knew you had to do. Like I knew you could do it. You were always, it was never that she wasn't smart enough. Like she always had it within her. 43:23 She just had to have the courage to, to step out and to try. - Yes. And most likely your mother had 43:29 to experience people telling her she wasn't enough people saying that because she didn't speak the native language, 43:35 that she wasn't enough. And that's been historical. What is your mom's name? 43:42 - Her name is Christina, but she goes by Tina. It's pretty awesome because now she actually works 43:48 at a school with low income Hispanic students. So it kinda came full circle. It's pretty awesome. 43:54 - And she's pouring into them ensuring that they don't feel the way that she felt when she was younger. 44:01 So Tina you said? Yes. Okay. I'm gonna be sending Tina some University 44:07 of Phoenix alumni stuff. Okay. So before, when before you leave me, make sure that I get her sizes 44:13 and I'm gonna spoil her to death because she deserves it and she's in create, she's created a wonderful daughter 44:20 and I definitely am so proud of her and all the things that she's done. So we, we wanna celebrate her as well. I love that. 44:28 So you went to �������� at such a young age you could have gone to a traditional university, maybe like a one that 44:37 with the campus and cheerleaders and a football team. Right? Why did you pick ��������? 'cause I'm all, 44:44 - So that's really interesting. Actually the summer before my senior year, I sound crazy, 44:51 but I had this dream and I actually felt like God was telling me I was supposed to go to this college. And that was super weird 44:57 because I didn't know anything about the college other than like my mom went there and I didn't know what I would be doing there. 45:03 Like I didn't know what my bachelor's would be in. And my parents told me a long time ago that I would be the one paying for my college. 45:09 So I was like, I don't know how I'm gonna afford this either. Like, I dunno anything about this, how I'm gonna pay for it, 45:14 what I'm gonna be doing. And as that senior year went on, I was talking to my high school counselor 45:20 and at the time I was on track to be valedictorian and she actually was telling me like, Kylie, don't do it. Like do not go, 45:27 this is like the biggest mistake in your life. Like you could go to anywhere in the state and they would pay you like full ride, like you can go anywhere you want. 45:33 But I just like, in the back of my head, I just had this feeling, it's that gut feeling of like, but I feel like I'm supposed to go here. I feel like I'm supposed to do this. 45:39 And so I eventually just had, okay, I'm just gonna do it full set. I'm, I'm gonna go to the ��������. 45:45 I dunno what I'm doing, but I'm just gonna trust that, that I had those thoughts and those feelings for a reason. 45:50 And you know, there's a purpose behind that. So January goes by, that's the state, a lot of the state school deadlines. 45:57 And so it's like, I'm locked in whether I want to or not, I'm going to ��������. And so as I was scrolling on the, 46:03 on the school's website looking at degree programs, I actually wasn't looking at a bachelor's. I was looking at a master's program 46:10 and as I'm looking, I, I scroll and I see one that says clinical mental health counseling. And I felt like, like God was saying like, 46:17 that's it, that's the one you're gonna do. And I was like, okay, well at least I know I'm gonna do now. 46:23 And so I, I click on it but it's like a, i, I see the bachelor's that you have to get in order to get your master's. 46:28 And so it's like this pipeline. And then I was looking at it and I was like thinking that it was correctional program support services 46:34 and I was thinking like, like a jail degree, like like a jail degree I need a jail degree for. 46:41 And that was pretty interesting 'cause at that time I didn't know anything about trafficking that was before had taken that college course. 46:50 So there were so many things that kind of just fell into place with that. And even for like my future plans. 46:56 And so yeah, I just, I just trusted that feeling that I was supposed to go to ��������. 47:02 And long story short, I went from I, 'cause I think it was a full close to like a $50,000 degree 47:08 and I had no money to pay for that. And I just kept praying and praying about it and I was like, I just don't wanna take out any student loans if I have 47:14 to take out student loans, not gonna to college. I kept praying like I'm not taking out any loans 47:20 and just through like miraculous circumstance after miraculous circumstance, I walked out debt free. 47:26 Like it was crazy. It was genuinely crazy. - That is, it sounds like it was a miracle 47:32 and that you have a clear destiny. Is it, did the pageants help at all in paying it? 47:37 I know that they're typically part of the scholarships. - Yeah, so that pageant almost paid for about $20,000. 47:47 - Oh my good. Tell me more about this pageant because I know that you've won a few. Tell me about that. 47:54 - Yeah, so I actually was not a pageant gal. I was not interested in it at all. 48:00 And the first one that I ever did, it was my junior year of high school. And the only reason I ICD me because they said, oh it all money 48:07 scholarships towards college. And I was, my ears perked up and I was like, oh, free money for college. Like, yeah, I'll do it. And so I, I went through that. 48:14 I ended up walking out, it was about $4,000 and I was Miss Conne and that was such a neat experience. 48:22 I met some lifelong friends in that program and as I came out of that I thought that I was gonna be a oneone. 48:28 It was super fun, but I'm not gonna do that again. It was super cool. And then one day my mom brings home a flyer from Mr. 48:33 Cities and she was like, Hey, you want more money for, for college? You know, look at this. And so I actually decided I was 48:40 gonna enter into that one that year I placed a first runner up and it was crazy 48:46 'cause just like the amount, I think that was one of the highest, or it's the highest scholarships 48:51 for women in Washington state. I didn't even win. I placed first runner up and I walked away. It was $6,000, which is more than I had won at Ms. 49:00 Conne, like being, you know, first place. And so I decided that I would run again. And when I ran again, I think that time I had walked away 49:09 with $12,000 all straight to my college. And so it was really crazy. It was just amazing. 49:16 - That is an amazing journey. So your, your pageants have helped pay for your education and you wanted to go to college. 49:24 You knew that you wanted to go to �������� though, you were told don't do that. Go to go to a, you know, a university with a campus 49:31 or have a traditional experience and you felt that this was supposed to be the university that you went to, waited until you couldn't go to the others 49:40 and then found the money to be able to be debt free by the end of your bachelor's degree. 49:48 - Yeah, and I think I kept hearing this over and over again. Well, Kylie, you're gonna miss out on the college experience. Well, Kylie, you're gonna miss out on the 49:54 college experience. And like growing up, I didn't really have great community. And it actually wasn't until probably my sophomore year 50:00 of high school that I finally found community. I finally found people that I, I felt like I was seeing and that I belonged. 50:07 And, you know, walking out of Covid, I struggled really bad with like depression and anxiety. And so finally coming out of that 50:14 and finally finding that sense of community, just to be told like, oh, well it's time for you to go off college. 50:19 I, I just knew that I wanted to stay within community where like I just felt seen and I felt known. And they also knew that I wanted to work full time. 50:27 I was like, why not be paying off things and also like, building your career while you're going to college. 50:32 I was like, it just makes sense to me. And so when people kept saying that, like, oh, just, you know, what about the college experience? 50:38 I was like, well, I already have community. I already have friends. The honest partying doesn't really interest me. 50:43 I have other folks that, you know, I'm passionate about. And I was able to not only 50:51 finish, you know, debt free, but I still have community. I'm working and it's been fantastic just 50:56 for career opportunities. And I would actually recommend it to lots 51:02 of, of, of high schoolers. You know, thinking about going to college of just because everybody goes to universities is not like, just 51:08 because of the cookie cutter path doesn't mean that it has to be your path because like, you don't want the college experience. 51:13 Like, that's okay. Like that's totally okay. I did way better doing online school than I ever did it in person. 51:19 And just having that flexibility allowed me to do so many different opportunities that I never would've been able 51:24 to if I had gone to a university. Like I traveled so much, I went to so many places, 51:31 you know, while I was working and doing college. 'cause I could just take my computer on my cruise. You know, like there can be 51:37 so many different opportunities for people. And if you, if you love traditional college, like yay, you go do it. 51:43 But like for people that don't wanna do that, you know, I think even though �������� is catered towards older audiences, 51:49 like take advantage of it, you know? - Absolutely. You know, we have, we actually have 51:55 younger people coming to ��������, and I imagine it is due to 2020 52:00 as everything ended up coming online. And we've been an online university for a very long time. 52:06 So we're well suited to, to take on those new students. If you were to speak to people in your generation, others 52:13 that are 18, 19, 20 years old, that also experienced some great depression in 2020, the 52:20 communication completely changed. What would you say to them to help guide them out of that, 52:27 even this five years later? - Yeah, so I would tell them that community is so important. 52:36 People are on social media too much these days. They need to get off and go touch grass. And I know it's easy to say, 52:41 but we are just constantly scrolling, scrolling, scrolling on our phones. And we're never in community with people. 52:47 We, we keep comparing our lives, you know, like, oh, look where they went. You know, they vacationed here. Oh, she has a boyfriend. 52:53 Oh, he has a boyfriend. Like, all these things are going on and you have to understand that social media is the best parts of other people's lives. 53:00 You know, there are things that I posted on my social media that, I mean, did happen when we're great, but at the same time it's like, oh, 53:06 well my grandma got diagnosed with cancer. Oh, well a close family member had a suicide attempt. Oh, you know, this something, you know, happened. 53:12 And all of those things can be true, but social media is only the best parts assembly's life. 53:18 And yet we have so many teenagers that are actually contemplating whether they should live 53:23 because they keep comparing their life to other people, and they never are in community. So they feel isolated. 53:28 They're just stuck in their room on their phone, you know, scrolling through TikTok, scrolling through Instagram, feeling like they're alone. 53:34 Like nobody sees them and nobody hears them. And they need community. They need to get involved with people 53:40 and to just know that they are seen and they are loved. And I think Gen Z, like my, my generation struggles 53:47 with an identity crisis. Like we have no idea who we are. Like we, we don't know our worth. 53:52 We don't understand our value, that we are actually precious. Like our lives are invaluable. Like we, we have so much worth 53:59 and I think we can place it in all the wrong things. I know for a long time I struggled with academic validation, 54:06 even though I was on track to be valedictorian because there's a cycle of like, well, if I don't get an A, then I'm not enough. Well if I don't do this, if I can't keep this, you know, 54:13 even while in college. And so like putting your kind of your ducks in a row and then understanding, no, actually this 54:19 is where your worth comes from. This is the foundation that you built your life on, that you know, no matter where you live 54:24 or what kind of car you have, or you know, if you have a latest closure, if you own turn, like your life has inherent value, 54:30 like your life is worth something, you have a purpose in your life. Even if you can't see it, even if you don't understand what 54:35 that is, it you have purpose and getting in community with people and getting off your phone, go live in real life. 54:42 Go, go. How many people, like, you know, who I just jumped to my friends about? We never see people in cast anymore. 54:48 Nobody wears cast anymore because they're not outside. But I would tell them that they need to go be out 54:54 and live in community. And something that I actually disclosed to my parents is, 54:59 you know, I, I probably was 14 years old when covid happened and I got to the point where I didn't know my identity, 55:06 I didn't understand my purpose. And it got to this point where I was like, why, you know, if, if all of you experience this pain, 55:12 what's the reason for being here? Like, why am I even here? You know? And had I actually followed 55:19 through on a suicide attempt like that, that was over five years ago, like I wouldn't have been here today. All of that, all my passion for anti-trafficking, 55:25 like all those lives I have touched all, all the people that I've been able to impact. You know, that never would've happened. 55:32 You know, like generations of of people who in the future, who I marry, you know, if I, when I have kids, like all of 55:38 that would be gone, you know, and all the people that you touch, like people need to understand that they are loved and they have value. 55:45 And I think that like we need to get off social media. We need to be in community with people 55:52 and understand the foundation of like, your life has value. You have purpose and, and build your life on that foundation. 55:59 - I couldn't agree more. And clearly your life has purpose. And I believe anyone listening to you right now, 56:04 hearing your words of encouragement or evaluating and recognizing that they have purpose as well, 56:10 your journey's been incredible and you've now started a podcast. I wanna hear all about it 56:17 and tell me who you're interviewing and what, like what that process, this is another something on this long list 56:22 of things you're doing. Tell me about how, how that's working for you, how you love it and what it's about. 56:29 - Yeah, so that actually first started for pageantry. So part of my CSI, we call 56:35 that a community service initiative. And that is a local program. It, it's an entryway into Miss America. 56:41 So as Miss Cities, I'll actually go compete next July for Ms. Washington. And if I were to win that, 56:47 then I would go compete for Miss America. So as part of that, I created this podcast just 56:53 to spread awareness in, in my community, but it's had an even cooler and farther impact because you can go look at demographics 56:59 and see like who's listening to you, where they're from. And I actually had people in Mexico listening to my podcast. 57:05 So that was pretty interesting to even have people, you know, across different nations be tuning in and listening. 57:10 And it really covers the three prongs of ending trafficking, that's pro protection prevention and prostitution. 57:17 I don't know if you've ever heard those terms, but those are the, that we call that three prong. And so within my community service initiative, 57:23 there are different elements that I'm trying to tackle. So one of those is just prevention 57:29 that starts with education. If you wanna prevent trafficking, if you wanna help people that are being trafficked, then they have 57:34 to be educated, right? They have to know what actually is trafficking, right? And yes, it is the white van's in the movie taken, 57:42 but also it's the little girl who's going to school every day, right? And you wouldn't think that, you'd think that, 57:48 well, they have to be transported. No, they don't. But you know, maybe one, one school year she's dressed normally as any kid would. 57:56 And then the next year it's like the swing, it's like the shift in attitude, behavior. She went from like an a b student to now she's failing. 58:03 She's, you know, D's and F's, she's falling asleep in class. Like, why are you sleeping in class? That should be a red flag indicator 58:09 that maybe you're not sleeping enough for the night. Like what's going on? And maybe it's her dress or the way that she's talking, she's 58:15 talking differently now. Maybe she has multiple phones, she's secretive, right? She, she's not in community anymore. 58:20 Like all the friends she used to hang out with, she's not hanging out with them anymore. And maybe she dresses either really provocatively now 58:27 where she didn't before or it's the, it's that swing shift. She, she dresses very, very in baggy clothes, 58:32 almost like she's trying to have the post swallow her or hide her. And so it's that kind of thing. Maybe she has the presence of an older boyfriend 58:39 or a secretive relationship that she, you know, doesn't wanna tell anybody about. Or maybe her phone is dinging all the time 58:45 and you know, she, she gets very stressed out. Like if you were to take her phone, she would have a meltdown 58:50 because she has to have access to that phone, right? And so if you have a trafficker who's saying, Hey, I'm gonna pick you up after school and take you to X, Y, 58:57 and Z, which does happen, like we've had case after case of this happening. Traffickers will pick these people up from school, 59:04 these children take them to a place to be traffic and then drop them off. And this happens in our community and it's just insane. 59:10 And so it's like understanding that it happens here and how that looks like, and then how we can respond to that. 59:16 I would say that anytime there is a social media app that has any kind of chat messaging system, there's a, 59:24 you know, you have access, you know, to people possibly being trafficked. So here's some crazy ones. 59:30 People have been trafficked through, through Pinterest. The Yeah, people have been trafficked through the Bible app. 59:37 The Bible app, yeah. Message through their like, it's just insane. People are very crafty. They're very manipulative 59:44 and they just will do anything they can to get access to children. So it's that prevention aspect. 59:49 You have to be educated on it, know what's happening, know what tactics that they're using. Social media is such a common one now. 59:56 And be increase in trafficking children on social media platforms has just gone through the roof 1:00:01 because ever since, you know, covid, everybody's online. So you just have like more of that presence. 1:00:07 And so my podcast really touches on different ways that we can combat it and educate the community so 1:00:12 that they have the tools to go out and reach and respond. So I've had conversations with even like our local mayor 1:00:19 talking about some of the controversies that have gone on in our, in our community and what she's doing to combat it and how we can help people. 1:00:25 I had the really, I was so excited, probably one of my favorite guests that I've ever had on my podcast 1:00:31 was a law enforcement, a law enforcement officer who used to work for icac and that is internet Crimes against Children task Force. 1:00:38 And so he had just a wealth of information on how child trafficking happens in the Tri-Cities 1:00:45 and how that links to online use and we call it cs a, that's child sexual abuse material. And how they identify that and they're able to prevent that. 1:00:52 And then his take on like, how do we help law enforcement? How can we educate law enforcement? 1:00:57 And we, we have, I I have to say we have made such great progress from even like 20 1:01:03 years ago because 20 years ago we would've arrested a child as like a pro. 1:01:08 We would've called 'em a child proxy, arrested them, and then they had that saying on the record for the rest of their lives. You know, and then you're just creating all these 1:01:14 barriers to reentry. So they're never actually able to leave the life, you know, and come like now in 2024, I don't know if you know this, 1:01:22 but in January 1st, 2024, RCW law in Washington changed 1:01:28 where a child can no longer be charged for prostitution because we now recognize and understand that a child cannot consent 1:01:35 to being sold for sex. They cannot consent to a commercial tax. And then that opened up so many doors of opportunity 1:01:42 for them to receive survivor services. And even in that year, preventing generations of people being trafficked. 1:01:49 Because unfortunately, a lot of times what happens is there's a person who gets trafficked and then when they grow up and they have children, 1:01:55 they'll traffic their children and they'll grow up and their children will traffic their children through a whole bunch of different reasons. 1:02:01 Whether it's drug abuse and it just continues being passed down, or just circumstances of like, 1:02:07 that's just kind of their life. They happens and they, they think it's more normal, it's not, but for them it's their version of normal. 1:02:12 So we have made significant progress in that legislative aspect and even looking forward to 2025 of getting 1:02:20 that education into schools, that teachers are equipped to be able to reach and respond to this. So that has been really exciting. 1:02:26 And so that's prosecution, right? And just protection of victims. I've talked with that and partnered 1:02:32 with different local nonprofit agencies within the Tri-Cities to talk about ways that we can help. 1:02:38 So I got to talk to a homeless, the, the executive director of a homeless teen shelter. 1:02:44 That was really cool just, and she was super child informed, super knowledgeable about what's going on. And that just gave me a lot of hope just 1:02:51 for the teens that she's assisting. And so that was really cool. And yeah, it's really just hitting that three-prong model of 1:02:58 what we can do to help combat trafficking. And there's a saying that we have at my work and it's, do what you love to fight what you hate. 1:03:05 And that kind of comes back to different giftings. Everybody's different. And that's absolutely okay and that's needed, right? 1:03:10 'cause we don't all wanna be the same thing 'cause we need different outlets and different ways of helping contributing. 1:03:16 But if you do what you love, and maybe that is art therapy. You're great at art, awesome. You know, come learn. 1:03:22 We'll, we'll teach you, you know, how to be trauma informed. And then you can actually assist survivors stepping with them into their rehabilitation journey 1:03:29 and help them through art therapy, right? So they're actually engaging both sides of their brains. 1:03:34 And so that then when they're able to open up on their trauma, it's not like this, it's this big scary monster that's coming out, right? 1:03:40 And they're feeling overwhelmed 'cause they're able to process that. And then we can actually go into the, the brain chemistry 1:03:46 and the functions behind that. It's actually really cool. And so there's that, there's music therapy, there's actually counseling one-on-one. 1:03:52 You love horses. We have, we have equine therapy that is really awesome where people who love horses are able 1:03:59 to do therapeutic programs with that. So really there's something for everybody. And that podcast just really touches on 1:04:05 how can you use your gifts to impact people - Will, well you are using your gift on the microphone. 1:04:13 You're using your gift while you're, while you're jogging, seeing random people and knowing, hey, I think 1:04:19 that they could be part of the life. You're, you're using your gift literally everywhere you go. 1:04:24 And even here on this podcast, because one of the great things about ��������, 1:04:29 'cause we have an incredible community, the people I've had the opportunity to interview, 1:04:37 they are, they're servant leaders. They are kind wise 1:04:44 and are doing incredible things in their field. And so not only do I know 1:04:49 that those people who've been on the podcast and that will, in the future, you can probably reach out to, 1:04:56 at the, at the very end of this podcast, we'll ask you for your information to share with others as well. Every one of them do that. 1:05:03 So whether they reach out to you or you, you reach out to them. You have a community, you have a community of people 1:05:10 who believe in you, who support you, and who also are Phoenix. 1:05:15 And so I love to hear about your podcast and that you are interviewing so many impactful people in the community, 1:05:23 learning more about from, from the judicial side 1:05:28 counseling and, and I imagine it, it just keeps going. And you're using this to not only spread the word 1:05:35 to your community and to others, even in Mexico, but also to help drive the pageant. 1:05:41 Which if I heard you clearly, when you win this one, 1:05:47 you go to Miss America. 1:05:52 Can you just help me understand how you're wrapping your mind around this? Because I've seen Miss America pageants, 1:05:59 this is a huge accomplishment. - Yeah. I'm actually just super honored to even be able 1:06:05 to go compete for Ms. Washington. That's not, a lot of people can say that they have. And so really humbling experience 1:06:12 and we, we often say within pageantry that the crown is actually a microphone 1:06:19 to just amplify whatever it is, you know, and your title itself is just, it's just a platform 1:06:25 to spring off of, you know, towards whatever plans you have in the future. And it's not just a year of, you know, makeup 1:06:32 and waving to people, but it's your year of service, you know, and you're actively working towards your goals of what you wanna implement in your community 1:06:38 and how you wanna help share that with others. - Yes. I actually know Miss Arizona, 1:06:44 she's an awesome person and she has been so kind. 1:06:49 And she was recently in the Veteran's Day parade, which �������� was at, and she totally spoiled my boys 1:06:55 and spent so much time with each individual veteran. And I know that it's a real heart job. 1:07:01 It's not necessarily just the dress and the makeup and the crown, but there's, there's a mission behind it all. 1:07:08 - Yeah, absolutely. - Well, we know your mission and we're excited to hear more about your podcast 1:07:13 and continue to listen to people that are on it. Tell me, how would we listen to the podcast? 1:07:18 Where would we be able to connect with you there? - Yeah, absolutely. So my podcast is available on Spotify 1:07:25 and it's called The Freedom Project by Kylie Glendening. And you guys are also able to follow my journey 1:07:30 through Instagram, and that's like the handle at the Freedom Project PC 1:07:36 for Tri-Cities is the Freedom Project pc. - Well, I know that I'll be following, and many, many of our other, of our listeners 1:07:43 and followers will be as well, because who doesn't wanna follow Kylie, the 19-year-old 1:07:49 who is the podcaster, a pageant winner, and going on to do other incredible things and e 1:07:56 and following her passion with saving people and giving back 1:08:01 and wanting to make sure that people know that they have worth and that their life has purpose. 1:08:06 So Kylie, I am overwhelmed by how incredible you are. 1:08:12 Thank you so much for joining us and for sharing all of that information with us. Tell us what's next, what, what, what's next for Kylie? 1:08:22 - So this one's pretty out there. Once I complete my master's degree in clinical mental health 1:08:27 counseling, I'm actually currently learning Arabic and I'm planning to do missions overseas in the Middle East 1:08:32 and actually use my, my jail degree to go and counsel inside jail. 1:08:39 - Of course, you're Of course you're, that is, 1:08:44 it's not, it's not out there. Right? It's, it's only impossible until you do it. It's only crazy until it's done. Right. 1:08:51 And, and I know Kylie, you'll get it done. So I will be following as many of our other listeners 1:08:57 and watchers will be excited to see you finish more of your degrees and more of your missions 1:09:03 and see you grow in that capacity. Thank you so, so much for joining us. 1:09:09 If you had any last words that you wanted to share with our listeners and viewers, what would that be? 1:09:16 - I would say that I think we're more capable than we know we are. 1:09:22 And we can set so many limits on ourselves and people's expectations of like, this is what I need 1:09:27 to be, this is what I have to be. And I would say, if God has put a dream in your heart, if God has given you this crazy ambitious, 1:09:35 really audacious goal, you would just be amazed what God will do if you give him your yes, 1:09:41 you just give it your yes. And you just step forward and you say, I don't know how this is gonna look like, I don't know how I'm gonna pay this, you know, 1:09:48 but I'm, I'm just gonna step forward in faith and say, you know what? I'm all in. Right. I think that some 1:09:54 of the greatest leaders in this world have just given their yes and stepped forward in that faith 1:10:00 and being able to impact so many people's lives and understanding that I, I truly, 1:10:06 I don't think I'm a super special person. I don't think that I'm overly important. I just think that I have a desire, I wanna see people free. 1:10:13 And that's, I think that's the purpose of the Freedom Project pertains to sex trafficking. But I wanna see more than that. 1:10:18 I wanna see people free from depression. I wanna see them free from anxiety, from from suicide, you know, I wanna see them free from trafficking, from, 1:10:26 you know, substance abuse. And that can look in so many different ways. But it starts with you stepping forward 1:10:32 and opening your mouth, right? And the end, if you're willing to just step forward and, and be that change, you know, 1:10:39 then you can impact so many people's lives. And I know on my Instagram a common phrase you'll hear over 1:10:44 and over, it says, we are the next generation. We are the change. You know? And so I think that can apply to every person. 1:10:52 - Yes, it can. You heard it here straight from Kylie. Be the change and say yes. 1:11:00 Find out what your dream and your passion is. And you can see here clearly Kylie did, 1:11:05 she's following that passion. She will continue to do that. And we will continue to follow your journey. 1:11:11 Thank you Kylie, so much for sharing all of your knowledge with us. We're looking forward to seeing what's coming up 1:11:17 here in the future. So we are gonna jump in to rapid fire questions. So the goal of rapid fire questions are to answer these 1:11:26 as quickly as possible. Okay. So there's a battle between all of the guests. Let's see, by the end of this season, who can answer all 1:11:32 of these questions as quickly as possible. So we have 10, are you ready? - Yep, I'm ready. - Okay. Early bird or night owl? 1:11:41 - Early bird. - Favorite book of all time? - The Bible. - Go-to karaoke song. 1:11:53 - Oh, oh, I know. I'll make a man of you by Mulan 1:11:59 - Biggest pet peeve. - Oh, leaving wet towels on the bed. Mm. 1:12:04 - If you had a superpower, what would it be? - Touching books and being able to absorb all the knowledge. 1:12:10 Just go to library. - Something you're surprisingly good at 1:12:19 - Writing. - Favorite way to de-stress - Running 1:12:27 - Most used emoji. - The, the two hearts with the swirl around them. 1:12:35 - Dream vacation spot. - Mm I, oh, I really wanna go to Thailand. 1:12:42 - And last one, if you had dinner with some historical figure, who would it be? - Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. 1:12:48 I've been waiting for this question. I would love to go because I'm gonna see Jesus one day, so I mean, I'm already gonna see him, so we gotta pick somebody else. 1:12:54 So I'm gonna pick Harriet Cuman because she's an abolitionist, a modern day abolitionist. 1:13:00 I wanna hear about her story, what it was like, you know, helping the Underground Railroad. And she actually is one of my favorite historical figures, 1:13:06 probably one of the most, you know, all time favorites just because of her courage under fire of like, she got 1:13:13 to freedom and went back for people. Like, she went into the danger when everybody else was running from it. 1:13:18 You know? She just had a heart for people and like this desire and passion to see other people free. 1:13:23 And I, I can resonate with that. - I'm confident you can Do you know what Harriet's last words were on her deathbed. 1:13:30 - I'll go to prepare a place for you. I go to prepare a place for you. - Yeah, - She's pretty awesome. 1:13:37 - She's really awesome. You, you are awesome. Thank you for just being so incredible and for joining us, 1:13:44 but then also for just being so transparent, open and doing what you're doing 1:13:50 because it really takes a great heart to serve and you're really serving. And somehow that makes it the end of this episode of Degrees 1:13:57 of Success podcast. I'm your host, Frida Richards, reminding you that your next chapter just might be your best one yet.